OneShiningMoment Wrote:I wished we coulda hired Pat Head Summitt 30 years ago for the Lady Tigers. :rofl: :bang:

I think a better hire for YOUR Memphis Tigers (men)...I agree...SHE'S HOT!

sportsfather Wrote:I don't really see it as an attack. It is obvious that comparing UL vs. UM programs is natural, especially considering the history and both schools making high profile coaching changes during a low point in their respective programs at about the same time.

I don't think there can be any denying Pitino has his team where we want to be and has done it in a shorter period of time. While we battle for a NIT title they are battling for a NCAA title.

The big question is when are we going to step up and start competing with the big boys for the big prize??

Wow...another logical poster on here...I love it.

If you don’t understand the pointlessness of your position you are either not a fan or lack a grasp of basic logic.

1) Cal IS our coach and WILL BE as long as he decides to stay here. therefore public criticism of him is pointless unless your goal is to damage the Tiger Program.

2) Cal was a great hire and Rickey was NOT available when we hired Cal. Everybody expected Cal to do better by now but he is a great coach and he has us on the right path

3) If you and Rainman were to get your way and run Cal, our basketball program WOULD fall of the face of the earth. We are in a precarious position right now and Cal is our best hope until we get out of this abortion of a league. with Cal we are a top 25-35 program without Cal we are not in the to 60.

Forrest Wrote:

CyberTiger Wrote:unless our fans are striving for NIT banners.

I haven't met one fan who is "striving" for NIT banners. I think most fans are making the best out of a bad situation. For example, if you find out your wife is cheating on you with the milkman, smile because the cheese will always be fresh.

Most fans are just supporting their team because they are still playing basketball. I dare say most fans would gladly trade the last three wins for one loss in the NCAA Tournament.

Many outsiders & critics confuse support for acceptance & I just don't believe that to be the case. Sure, the fairweathers walked away saying "Damn Tigers" as Darius dropped to the FEF floor in tears on national TV. The rest of accepted our fate & cheered the team on because they are our team.

I cried when Darius missed those shots, not for me, but for him, and I'm glad to see the city get behind him.

And I love cheese.

I will say (and I like Cal, but i'm not a homer, i'll criticize if he deserves it) Cal singlehandly (even before Tommy got the fball thing going) put this university and this basketball program back on the map and back in the national spotlight. He has done more for this program nationally than any other coach in Memphis history. Albeit that prior to the NCAA lawsuit in the late 80's, team's could only be on tv 3 times in two years outside the NCAA or NIT tournaments. However, Cal has put Memphis basketball on the national map, mainly with his name, but also with his recruiting.

Sure, we've had guys fall through the cracks and go NBA, but he's still turning out Top 10, even Top 5 recruiting classes year in and year out. I think when he took over this program, he knew and we should have too as a love-when-your good-hate-you-when-your-bad fan base, that this thing would take some time. Hell, this season was singlehandly shot when a "bad apple" decided that he was not going to do his part in the classroom and be a "team" player.

Cal's won 20 or more games every single year since he's been here, that's not too damn bad. We're not going to develop into a dynasty or a national power overnight, but we're getting better. Yes, we have great basketball tradition, but as so many of you say, let's not live in the past with traditions, but in the present with what we've got. Well, we have a NCAA-caliber team that probably went through more this season than any other Tiger team in Cal's era and maybe longer. Championships are championships, and this team is playing for its 2nd Championship in the Calipari era.

Now, national spotlights are not everything, winning is. I think he's done that (20+ wins per year), maybe the next step is winning the "big" ones. Who Knows? I can honestly say that it's somewhat ironic that in 2002 we didn't get in b/c we didn't play a tough enough schedule, and now we didn't get in b/c we played too tough a schedule for this young team? Cal's trying damn hard to build a program here that was non-existant since 1996. We're going to have to play some tough folks to build up our team, some times you win, some times you lose. But with this foundation (D-Wash, Dorsey, Carney...please stay, the Laurinburg kids...better stay), I like where Cal is taking this program.

Each year, more and more excitement surrounds this program, we haven't seen that in nearly 10 years. So the question is, are you going to support YOUR Tigers and what Cal is doing? Or are you going to sit at home and pout b/c we can't win them all? We're not Kentucky, not Duke, not UNC, but we're trying to be and I think we have the man to build a program to get there. Five years from now, who know's what will happen. But for now, the best thing you, me and we all can do is support this team, go to the games, give to the TSF (to help pay for these youngens) and become a fan base, a home crowd that actually makes a difference. "Ville fans talk about how loud they are at Freedom Hall and how much a of difference they make, hell, we can do it too...I've seen it done before, we can do it again. Get 'em Coach and LET'S GO TIGERS!

BinghamptonNed Wrote:If you don’t understand the pointlessness of your position you are either not a fan or lack a grasp of basic logic.

1) Cal IS our coach and WILL BE as long as he decides to stay here. therefore public criticism of him is pointless unless your goal is to damage the Tiger Program.

2) Cal was a great hire and Rickey was NOT available when we hired Cal. Everybody expected Cal to do better by now but he is a great coach and he has us on the right path

3) If you and Rainman were to get your way and run Cal, our basketball program WOULD fall of the face of the earth. We are in a precarious position right now and Cal is our best hope until we get out of this abortion of a league. with Cal we are a top 25-35 program without Cal we are not in the to 60.

Are you TigerLoyal?

BinghamptonNed Wrote:If you don’t understand the pointlessness of your position you are either not a fan or lack a grasp of basic logic.

1) Cal IS our coach and WILL BE as long as he decides to stay here. therefore public criticism of him is pointless unless your goal is to damage the Tiger Program.

2) Cal was a great hire and Rickey was NOT available when we hired Cal. Everybody expected Cal to do better by now but he is a great coach and he has us on the right path

3) If you and Rainman were to get your way and run Cal, our basketball program WOULD fall of the face of the earth. We are in a precarious position right now and Cal is our best hope until we get out of this abortion of a league. with Cal we are a top 25-35 program without Cal we are not in the to 60.

Great job, Ned. You should have a radio show in Memphis! :laugh:

CyberTiger Wrote:

BinghamptonNed Wrote:If you don’t understand the pointlessness of your position you are either not a fan or lack a grasp of basic logic.

1) Cal IS our coach and WILL BE as long as he decides to stay here. therefore public criticism of him is pointless unless your goal is to damage the Tiger Program.

2) Cal was a great hire and Rickey was NOT available when we hired Cal. Everybody expected Cal to do better by now but he is a great coach and he has us on the right path

3) If you and Rainman were  to get your way and run Cal, our basketball program WOULD fall of the face of the earth. We are in a precarious position right now and Cal is our best hope until we get out of this abortion of a league. with Cal we are a top 25-35 program without Cal we are not in the  to 60.

Are you TigerLoyal?

I think Tiger loyal is a great person.

What does that have to do with my argument that your position is pointless for a Tiger fan?

tigerpikapp Wrote:I will say (and I like Cal, but i'm not a homer, i'll criticize if he deserves it) Cal singlehandly (even before Tommy got the fball thing going) put this university and this basketball program back on the map and back in the national spotlight. He has done more for this program nationally than any other coach in Memphis history. Albeit that prior to the NCAA lawsuit in the late 80's, team's could only be on tv 3 times in two years outside the NCAA or NIT tournaments. However, Cal has put Memphis basketball on the national map, mainly with his name, but also with his recruiting.

Sure, we've had guys fall through the cracks and go NBA, but he's still turning out Top 10, even Top 5 recruiting classes year in and year out. I think when he took over this program, he knew and we should have too as a love-when-your good-hate-you-when-your-bad fan base, that this thing would take some time. Hell, this season was singlehandly shot when a "bad apple" decided that he was not going to do his part in the classroom and be a "team" player.

Cal's won 20 or more games every single year since he's been here, that's not too damn bad. We're not going to develop into a dynasty or a national power overnight, but we're getting better. Yes, we have great basketball tradition, but as so many of you say, let's not live in the past with traditions, but in the present with what we've got. Well, we have a NCAA-caliber team that probably went through more this season than any other Tiger team in Cal's era and maybe longer. Championships are championships, and this team is playing for its 2nd Championship in the Calipari era.

Now, national spotlights are not everything, winning is. I think he's done that (20+ wins per year), maybe the next step is winning the "big" ones. Who Knows? I can honestly say that it's somewhat ironic that in 2002 we didn't get in b/c we didn't play a tough enough schedule, and now we didn't get in b/c we played too tough a schedule for this young team? Cal's trying damn hard to build a program here that was non-existant since 1996. We're going to have to play some tough folks to build up our team, some times you win, some times you lose. But with this foundation (D-Wash, Dorsey, Carney...please stay, the Laurinburg kids...better stay), I like where Cal is taking this program.

Each year, more and more excitement surrounds this program, we haven't seen that in nearly 10 years. So the question is, are you going to support YOUR Tigers and what Cal is doing? Or are you going to sit at home and pout b/c we can't win them all? We're not Kentucky, not Duke, not UNC, but we're trying to be and I think we have the man to build a program to get there. Five years from now, who know's what will happen. But for now, the best thing you, me and we all can do is support this team, go to the games, give to the TSF (to help pay for these youngens) and become a fan base, a home crowd that actually makes a difference. "Ville fans talk about how loud they are at Freedom Hall and how much a of difference they make, hell, we can do it too...I've seen it done before, we can do it again. Get 'em Coach and LET'S GO TIGERS!

Very nice.

Calipari is good enough to make the question difficult to answer.

But Rick Pitino is one of the top five coaches in college basketball. A slam-dunk HOF coach.

"I will say (and I like Cal, but i'm not a homer, i'll criticize if he deserves it) Cal singlehandly (even before Tommy got the fball thing going) put this university and this basketball program back on the map and back in the national spotlight. "

Agreed



"but he's still turning out Top 10, even Top 5 recruiting classes year in and year out. "

Then why only 1 ncaa victory in 5 years? Bad coaching, or players who don't adjust to your style, so a case of not recruiting the right ones?


"Cal's won 20 or more games every single year since he's been here, that's not too damn bad. "

Give me 14 win seasons and 3 sweet 16s


"Championships are championships, and this team is playing for its 2nd Championship in the Calipari era. "

YES! Although no one cares or will remember outside of Memphis.


"Cal's trying damn hard to build a program here that was non-existant since 1996. "

Agreed once again

Draelius Wrote:Calipari is good enough to make the question difficult to answer.

But Rick Pitino is one of the top five coaches in college basketball. A slam-dunk HOF coach.

I enjoy reading posts from those who understand the root of the question, and not those wearing 'blue colored glasses' (is that right).


Forrest, Ned can't have a radio show until he figures out which spot is best for his realtor career.

I can accept when people say that Cal has been good as far as putting the program in the spotlight. But when i hear people say things like Cal is a "godsend" borders on being just plain ridiculous!
3NIT'S, 2 NCAA'S nuff said.

Winning can give you as much pub as any fast talking coach can ever give you.

Did Pitino have to completely rebuild his practice facilities? Or was that Cal?

Did Pitino's program change arenas, reseat every season ticket holder, and completely lose their home court advantage? Or was that Cal?

Did Pitino's program have to face the doom and gloom of their conference falling apart? Or was that Cal?

I'm not one for excuses, but just how much better would Cal's teams have been without the distractions? How much worse would Pitino's teams have been with those distractions?

When you look at the off-court obstacles that Cal has had against him, these last four years have been a phenominal success.

Tigerdave1985 Wrote:I can accept when people say that Cal has been good as far as putting the program in the spotlight. But when i hear people say things like Cal is a "godsend" borders on being just plain ridiculous!
3NIT'S, 2 NCAA'S nuff said.

Winning can give you as much pub as any fast talking coach can ever give you.

Wow!!! The smart ones are coming out of the wood work. Another poster with a head on his shoulders.

Why can't there be more like this instead of those blind optimists?

Forrest Wrote:

BinghamptonNed Wrote:If you don’t understand the pointlessness of your position you are either not a fan or lack a grasp of basic logic.

1) Cal IS our coach and WILL BE as long as he decides to stay here. therefore public criticism of him is pointless unless your goal is to damage the Tiger Program.

2) Cal was a great hire and Rickey was NOT available when we hired Cal. Everybody expected Cal to do better by now but he is a great coach and he has us on the right path

3) If you and Rainman were  to get your way and run Cal, our basketball program WOULD fall of the face of the earth. We are in a precarious position right now and Cal is our best hope until we get out of this abortion of a league. with Cal we are a top 25-35 program without Cal we are not in the  to 60.

Great job, Ned. You should have a radio show in Memphis! :laugh:

So should you, Forrest! :laugh:

Claw Wrote:I'm not one for excuses

Could have fooled me :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Give Cal and Pitino 4 years each, and it appears Pitino would out perform him if they were playing in a corn patch.

CyberTiger Wrote:

Chi-Town Wrote:

CyberTiger Wrote:

Chi-Town Wrote:

CyberTiger Wrote:

Chi-Town Wrote:

CyberTiger Wrote:

Chi-Town Wrote:

CyberTiger Wrote:which one would be more deserving of a million dollars a year?  honest answers only, no matter how many national recruits or tv games we've had.

You can't argue with their success but the cupboard was hardly bare when Pitino got there....unlike here. I'll take Cal.....

That argument is bs...it's been 5 years...that's a possible 20 players the way Cal recruits. The 'pitino had more to work with argument' is crap. Lville wasn't exactly loaded with mac all americans.

Pitino followed a Hall of Fame Coach....Cal followed the Tic years....(disallowing the mulligan that was Johnny Jones)....and thats crap?

Hall of Fame coach who had worn out his welcome by 5 years but no one wanted to tell him to leave...yes that's crap...pull up the rosters and show me they were more loaded with talent...then I'll believe it. I almost believe Pitino had less to work with...but regardless, 5 f'in years after Cal is hired and you're still using the 'he didn't have much to start with' crap. 5 years is plenty of time to build a basketball team of 10. Cal didn't recruit that intelligently...he went after the names, not the college players...and he still does it.

I did not say they were loaded, I said he had more to work with. Fan support and name recognition were never in question at Louisville. They were here. Cal had to rebuild an entire program, from the ground up. Pitino had to sit in a seat warmed by tradition and consistent success, as well as a cupboard that was NOT BARE. Ours was slim pickin's at best. Shyrone Chatman, Shannon Forman, Earl Barron, Marcus Moody, Scoo (who?), Lou Wright (grades), Courtney friggin Trask, all non-descript college players. Are you saying UL's talent was at that level?

I agree that recruiting has been a challenge. But you are faulting Cal for outrecruiting UL (and most others) to the point that we had almost all of our main recruits each year opt for the NBA? How can he predict that K.Perkins will opt to be a late first rounder?

Cal has been a Godsend for the U of M. Your comparison just doesn't hold water.....

Lil Rock, your argument doesn't hold water, and not surprisingly, you don't like to admit you're wrong. Lville was 12-19 before Pitino took over. Fan support? What else is there to do in Lville. Memphis is a fair weathered sports town by nature.

Out recruit name players all you want but what good does it do in 'building a program' when you're recruiting players no one else will because they know they aren't going to college. Maybe Perkins was the only shock, but come on...there were enough classes to build a foundation and he has struggled.

Cal could have rebuilt this program quicker if he had recruited smarter. Has he been great for publicity? Sure. But most of us are more interested in other things than publicity. Anderson has had more NCAA success than Cal in recent history, has he not?

What else is there to do in the 'Ville? That is the crux of your point? Puhleez

Careful with the personal attacks, or this will denigrate into less than a logical debate.

You say everyone knew that our recruits were going NBA, I say hogwash....yuo recruit the best you can, and with todays landscape you literally have to hope that they come.

I think he has built a tremendous "foundation".

What's the personal attack? The fact you don't live in 'Chi-Town' and I called you Lil Rock?

If the foundation is so good, why are we in the NIT?

[b]your argument doesn't hold water, and not surprisingly, you don't like to admit you're wrong[/b}

That looks like a personal attack to me. My skin is thick, just stick to the facts.

Chi-Town Wrote:

CyberTiger Wrote:

Chi-Town Wrote:

CyberTiger Wrote:

Chi-Town Wrote:

CyberTiger Wrote:

Chi-Town Wrote:

CyberTiger Wrote:

Chi-Town Wrote:

CyberTiger Wrote:which one would be more deserving of a million dollars a year?  honest answers only, no matter how many national recruits or tv games we've had.

You can't argue with their success but the cupboard was hardly bare when Pitino got there....unlike here. I'll take Cal.....

That argument is bs...it's been 5 years...that's a possible 20 players the way Cal recruits. The 'pitino had more to work with argument' is crap. Lville wasn't exactly loaded with mac all americans.

Pitino followed a Hall of Fame Coach....Cal followed the Tic years....(disallowing the mulligan that was Johnny Jones)....and thats crap?

Hall of Fame coach who had worn out his welcome by 5 years but no one wanted to tell him to leave...yes that's crap...pull up the rosters and show me they were more loaded with talent...then I'll believe it. I almost believe Pitino had less to work with...but regardless, 5 f'in years after Cal is hired and you're still using the 'he didn't have much to start with' crap. 5 years is plenty of time to build a basketball team of 10. Cal didn't recruit that intelligently...he went after the names, not the college players...and he still does it.

I did not say they were loaded, I said he had more to work with. Fan support and name recognition were never in question at Louisville. They were here. Cal had to rebuild an entire program, from the ground up. Pitino had to sit in a seat warmed by tradition and consistent success, as well as a cupboard that was NOT BARE. Ours was slim pickin's at best. Shyrone Chatman, Shannon Forman, Earl Barron, Marcus Moody, Scoo (who?), Lou Wright (grades), Courtney friggin Trask, all non-descript college players. Are you saying UL's talent was at that level?

I agree that recruiting has been a challenge. But you are faulting Cal for outrecruiting UL (and most others) to the point that we had almost all of our main recruits each year opt for the NBA? How can he predict that K.Perkins will opt to be a late first rounder?

Cal has been a Godsend for the U of M. Your comparison just doesn't hold water.....

Lil Rock, your argument doesn't hold water, and not surprisingly, you don't like to admit you're wrong. Lville was 12-19 before Pitino took over. Fan support? What else is there to do in Lville. Memphis is a fair weathered sports town by nature.

Out recruit name players all you want but what good does it do in 'building a program' when you're recruiting players no one else will because they know they aren't going to college. Maybe Perkins was the only shock, but come on...there were enough classes to build a foundation and he has struggled.

Cal could have rebuilt this program quicker if he had recruited smarter. Has he been great for publicity? Sure. But most of us are more interested in other things than publicity. Anderson has had more NCAA success than Cal in recent history, has he not?

What else is there to do in the 'Ville? That is the crux of your point? Puhleez

Careful with the personal attacks, or this will denigrate into less than a logical debate.

You say everyone knew that our recruits were going NBA, I say hogwash....yuo recruit the best you can, and with todays landscape you literally have to hope that they come.

I think he has built a tremendous "foundation".

What's the personal attack? The fact you don't live in 'Chi-Town' and I called you Lil Rock?

If the foundation is so good, why are we in the NIT?

[b]your argument doesn't hold water, and not surprisingly, you don't like to admit you're wrong[/b}

That looks like a personal attack to me. My skin is thick, just stick to the facts.

You're kidding, right? You've gotten so attached to your Internet moniker that you're upset I called you by another city???? :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Come on. You never do admit when you're wrong. You like to debate/argue, do you not?

all i'm going to say is this. If y'all are going to go back to the past and talk about, "we should of hired Coach K when we had the chance". Coach K was nearly run out of Durham after only three years of coaching there. He lost to the Butlers of the world. He lost to Carolina by 30. They were getting steamrolled at home. But he had an AD that stuck with him, some past experience with Coach Knight that some believed he could bring to Duke and he stayed. Now look at him, 648 wins, 66 tourney wins and 3 national championships later, he's regarded as one of the greatest to every coach the game.

Now I'm not comparing Coach K to Cal, b/c that's silly and I will say this isn't Cal's first go around, but neither was it for K (he coached at Army for four or five years). Cal cannot do this thing in one year, programs take time. Would you rather be a one and done 2 of every 5 years or let him build us into consistent tournament visitors with chances to make a run? I'm voting for the latter and the latter takes time. Geez, we're roasting a coach that's one over a 100 games sinces he's been here and already some are calling for his head. We'll be fine, b/c he won't give up as a coach. Now we can't as fans. Go Tigers.